If you have not seen the film (or read the book) and do not wish to read spoilers, stay out of this thread
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hannah kipje |
Atonement *SPOILER THREAD* |
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Here you can can post about Atonement without using spoiler tags.
If you have not seen the film (or read the book) and do not wish to read spoilers, stay out of this thread |
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CUBABC |
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Oh, goodie, goodie...Okay, so I have a question, I know that Robbie died of Septicemia, caused by the
unattended wound to his chest, but why do you think he kept it hidden?...Being a Medical student, he must of known the consequences of not treading the
wound...Do you think he had a death wish of sorts, because...
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Sophz456 |
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He wasn't a Med student, he was sent off to war before he got the chance
I don't think he'd ever give up, I don't think he realised what was wrong with him, towards the end he would have become delerious, and there was no way Robbie could ever be cured. Septicemia is normally fatal, it's very serious (the blood itself becomes septic), so even if he hadn't've kept it hidden, he couldn't have been cured. Also, at the beginning of the Dunkirk scene, the Sergeant/Commander/Higher person in authority says they had orders to leave the wounded behind, so Robbie wouldn't have said anything for fear of not being allowed home.
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Mylan512 |
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Yeah.... I agree with Sophy. I don't think Robbie realized how badly he was hurt, and by the time he would've figured it out.... he was going
delusional. I don't think Robbie would have ever given up on returning home to Cecelia. Never. She was his driving force. When he had the vision of his
mother washing his feet, he said that he was always keeping her waiting and that she loves him, and you can see in his delusional, yet sincere eyes, that he
was determined to make it back to her. When he went back to Netty, he was adamant about finding that cottage.
Poor Robbie.
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CUBABC |
#4 | |||
Sophz456 wrote: I thought he was premed, from what he told Cecilia in fountain scene. I think he had an idea that what he had was bad, that's why he probably kept it hidden, imo... If they would have caught it early on, he could have been treated, but your right, at that point it would have been fatal. I am surprised he lasted that long... |
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Sophz456 |
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They didn't have penicillin in those days, so there was no treatment for it
- I asked my mum who has a medical degree if there was anyway Robbie could
survive if he had been treated in the first stages of septicemia for my fan fiction but she said no
Cee says: The Old Man telephoned last night, he says you were planning on being a doctor. Robbie replies: I've been thinking about it yes. What I gathered from that was he was only just thinking about it. But I suppose he may have read up on things (He did own a copy of Gray's Anatomy) Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, so I suppose we can interpret things differently
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Bluebell66 |
#6 | |||
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When I think about what Robbie had to go through my heart breaks in million pieces...
He is the main reason I can't bring myself to forgive Briony, in any way, shape or form. Everytime I try to understand her a little bit, I remember the hell she put him into, and it's really impossible to accept what she did. I agree with Mylan and Sophie that Robbie was very detemined to return. The way he says "I will return...our story will resume" is very determined, like he would never admit another option. When he sees his mother, even being delusional he was adamant about it. The way he says "...and she loves me. She's waiting for me" is so full of hope...
And even when he was almost dying, when Nettle tells him about the ships returning, he smiles a little bit. I'm sure that Robbie died convinced that he would be in one of those ships (altough I have another way to interpret that scene and I'll talk about it later). And, btw, that's the same perception we get from the novel - even on his darkest hours, he never gave in on hope. In a way I think that, since Robbie was wounded, he started to live in some delusional world. Maybe it was the effect of his illness, but also that he knew, in a way, that his was a serious case and there was a possibility that he wouldn't make it. So he chose irreality over reality. Maybe, if he had told Nettle and Mace about it, they would have helped him search for some medical aid - even if he couldn't be cured, was there a possibility he would survive long enough to at least return to England and die near Cee and his mother? Oh, well, who knows...but maybe, refusing to think that he could die, that he had to return to Cee, that it was the only possibility after all the horrible things that had happened to them, allowed him some illusions to deal with his own awful reality...
And since we are talking about reality vs irreality...here's the interpretation of Robbie's final scene I wanted to talk about. The other day I was watching again (on You Tube, because the dvd wasn't released here yet) the moment when Robbie has the "reward" nightmare and Nettle wakes him up. Robbie says something like "Thing is, I've decided to stay a little bit...I'm meeting someone and I'm always keeping her waiting..." What do you make of "I've decided to stay"? I've never thought about it much, even though "to stay" is a contradiction to his wish "to return". But following Robbie's delusional logic, since Nettle told him the cottage "is here", and Robbie believed him, maybe he thought he was really there after all and this time he had to wait for her, because Cee was the one who was always waiting for him? Something like "She said she would meet me at the cottage by the beach and now that I'm here I can't leave..." When I thought about it this way the scene was even more poignant...
Last Edited By: Bluebell66 16/05/2008 06:43.
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Sophz456 |
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Oh my God Bluebell!! I never thought of Robbie's final scene in that way.... But now you've said that I think you're right.
That must mean that in Robbie's delusional world... He must have died in the "cottage"... That's so sad. During the scene when Cecilia dies, I always get the impression Cecilia almost wanted to die. At that point she knew Robbie was dead, and since Robbie was her 'one reason for life', when she saw the water and had a very calm, almost expectant look on her face. All Cecilia and Robbie wanted to do was be together, and the place they longed to meet up was the cottage by the beach. I really liked that there's where we see them for the final time. Together. Happy. In love. This has probably been said before, but I think that we what we see is Robbie and Cecilia's heaven.
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hannah kipje |
#8 | |||
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I have never been doubtful about why he hides the wound. The key is in the book. He is a natural leader and he has a map
only he can read, so the two other soldiers follow him to Dunkirk, but they both have a higher rank than Robbie, which is what makes him as a leader sort of a
thing to be ashamed of by the Mace and Nettle. This is why they tease him relentlessly with all kinds of things and Robbie has to stay the stronger one. Since
he has no way of getting his hands on meds (they did have penicillin in those days Rory, it was WWI where they didn't have it yet) it is better not to show
any kind of weakness, including being wounded...
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Mylan512 |
#9 | |||
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These are all great insights.
Bluebell, I re-watched Robbie's last scene, and it makes sense him wanting to stay there because he already thinks he's in the cottage. It's sad, but at the same time, I'm glad Robbie thinks that's where he died. At least there was some peace knowing that he finally made it.
Hannah, What you said about Robbie not wanting to show his weakness because he had to lead makes me love Robbie more. He's not only a lover, but he's a fighter and a leader.
I have a question. Staying in the same scene (Robbie's dying scene).... he closes his eyes to sleep and he remembers the night he was taken away to jail, they flash a scene where he walks through the field of poppies. Do you think the director used that as kind of a foreshadowing of Robbie's death? Because he dies shortly after that flashback, but we don't find that out until the end. After re-watching it a gazillion times.... I started to take notice of that scene more, and it looks like he was taking his final walk in that scene. What do you guys think? |
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CUBABC |
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Sophz456 wrote: Penicillin was available those days. In 1942, the first patient was successfully treated for streptococcal septicemia, with US made penicillin. It made a huge difference during WWII, in treating patients with amputations and infected wounds. Edited to shorten quote
Last Edited By: hannah kipje 16/05/2008 23:42.
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